the Magicball Network Forums

the Magicball Network Forums (https://forum.magicball.net/index.php)
-   Off topic (https://forum.magicball.net/forumdisplay.php?f=11)
-   -   Official 2020 Apocalypse Thread for MBN Survivors (https://forum.magicball.net/showthread.php?t=18421)

ChaosFish 2020-03-27 13:17

Official 2020 Apocalypse Thread for MBN Survivors
 
Long time no be.

I'm losing my shits. And there's a coup in my country now on top of everything. From democracy to dictatorship in the blink of an eye.

Scared to death of the virus. War of the Worlds scenario. So why no escape to the past. MBN, how are you dealing?

johnnybrubacker 2020-03-28 01:32

Unfortunately I've got no escape from the virus - as soon I'll be redeployed to the frontline medical specialities - either emergency medicine, itu or acute medicine. Without proper PPE equipment from the government (research says that viral load - linked to time spent with the infected has an effect on symptoms), I'm scared for my safety - but more my parents.

SebZ 2020-03-28 03:12

Saying that 2020 kicked it up a notch is a gross understatement.

My work closed for a couple of weeks, so I've been at home twiddling my thumbs and playing around with code.
The Aust government have their heads in the sand. Not as bad as Trump has been these last couple of weeks, but bad enough that our PM is threatening to do his job "if we don't behave" - SMH

I do hope that everyone's safe and well though

Neko 2020-03-28 13:35

working and composing from home,

hope my family stays safe, it's kinda scary but you hope for the best.
Stay safe everyone

Reek 2020-03-29 21:50

https://media.giphy.com/media/K6aZlaZEJjt4s/giphy.gif

ChaosFish 2020-04-05 04:43

2 Attachment(s)
My little contribution to the world. Title screens are important.
Attachment 10311

DedalousDiggle 2020-04-06 02:22

I’ve been unemployed for a couple weeks now. Probably will be for a couple months more. All things considered I’ve got it easy. I’m relatively young and in good shape, will be ok financially as long as this doesn’t last a year. Even so, the longer it lasts the less choice there will be about government assistance. My country in general is fucked, however. Hundreds of thousands will die.

SpaceGuitarist 2020-04-21 00:35

quote #38:
at Citadel Island
It is forbidden to travel outside the Citadel in that kind of attire!

sean121 2020-04-28 10:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459065)
I’ve been unemployed for a couple weeks now. Probably will be for a couple months more. All things considered I’ve got it easy. I’m relatively young and in good shape, will be ok financially as long as this doesn’t last a year. Even so, the longer it lasts the less choice there will be about government assistance. My country in general is fucked, however. Hundreds of thousands will die.

Same here Man. This virus ruining everyone's life anyway whether you have this virus or not.

Battler 2020-04-28 15:50

Here in Slovenia, it's rather fine. We're hovering around 6 new cases per day these days (was around 40-something at the peak), so it seems to be subsiding. It also seems to be subsiding in Italy, yesterday there were only 1739 new cases, it hasn't been this low in a month and a half.

I'm concerned now about Russia, however, they have quite the spike there, especially in Moscow, and about Japan... since I know people in both countries.

- ChaosFish: How exactly has Israel become a dictatorship? I thought they simply had an agreement between two parties to form a shared government, which is nothing unusual - Italy and Slovenia both have coalition governments as well. The only country that has come close to becoming a dictatorship lately, is Hungary where Orbán has managed to have the Parliament give him unlimited powers for as long as he wants.

ChaosFish 2020-05-04 00:38

Obras: This agreement between the parties has nothing to do with democracy. People have voted for the opposing party for the sole purpose of replacing the criminal running the state. The common assumption is that the opposing party leader was being blackmailed or otherwise threatened and forced to bend over.

Reek 2020-05-07 01:05

Sorry but that's not the common assumption at all. The common assumption is that the opposition leader backed himself into a corner when his party split in two (one half was against joining the current PM in a joint government) and now the opposition leader has much less leverage and stands to lose much more than the PM if we went for another round of elections. So he's capitulating to the PM's demands to an extent in order to make a joint government possible.

Carajo 2020-05-25 09:04

I'm sorry to hear about some of you guys at the other side of the ocean are having a rough time. I hope it gets better soon in the summer.

Here in Chile we are entering the winter season and it is going to get bad. We have 40+ deads and 3800+ infected per day. Poor people are out in protests because they can't work and there is minimal aid from the government.

It is crazy, isn't it? It's like we're living in a dystopian movie.

ChaosFish 2020-05-26 17:41

We're living in the prequel, the real thing will begin once the icebergs melt.

Phreak 2020-05-28 20:31

You need the flute to melt the iceburgs

Carajo 2020-05-31 02:25

funny and sad

Phreak 2020-07-05 20:34

Due to the fact the pandemic is easing I thought I'd bump this so we can all post how we're getting on and how we all found it

Grower 2020-07-16 19:01

So why no escape to the past. MBN, how are you dealing?

DedalousDiggle 2020-07-22 23:43

Things are not going well here.

DedalousDiggle 2020-11-23 01:32

So I’m still without a proper job, though I could fix that tomorrow if I decided to. I’m getting by doing odd jobs, getting to work alone and work with my hands. Not bad. Still hoping my government provides some sort of assistance by the end of the year but I’m not holding my breath. My line of work is dead, at least for the kind of money I used to make. Bars are dropping like flies around the country. I’m just trying to find out what I’m going to do next, meanwhile staying afloat on my wave of just enough good luck.

Cases are getting really bad here. Up until September or so my state’s record was up to 2000 new cases a day, our new record is over 8300. Bars and restaurants are open and with temps getting below freezing as early as next week dining is moving completely inside. It’s awful how many people aren’t taking it seriously, and many of my friends are stuck working at places full of the sporadically masked general public just to pay their bills. Very few places can enforce mask rules, most places only allow their staff to ask once nicely and then drop it after too many incidents of assault by crazy assholes.

I know two people personally who tested positive this week, another who just lost their dad to it. Still got invited to two different Thanksgiving celebrations this coming week, each hosted by people who think the election was stolen but can’t quite articulate how. One of whom already almost died of covid. Fucking idiots.

In other news, I’ve gotten super into playing Hades. Without a proper job to provide structure to my life I stayed up until 5am last night/this morning playing. It totally uses a sound effect that sounds like an LBA sound effect whenever you miss a certain action, which made me think of all you nerds here. Hopefully things are going better for those of you who live in countries with at least semi-competent leadership.

SpaceGuitarist 2020-12-05 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459399)
So I’m still without a proper job, though I could fix that tomorrow if I decided to. I’m getting by doing odd jobs, getting to work alone and work with my hands. Not bad. Still hoping my government provides some sort of assistance by the end of the year but I’m not holding my breath. My line of work is dead, at least for the kind of money I used to make. Bars are dropping like flies around the country. I’m just trying to find out what I’m going to do next, meanwhile staying afloat on my wave of just enough good luck.

Cases are getting really bad here. Up until September or so my state’s record was up to 2000 new cases a day, our new record is over 8300. Bars and restaurants are open and with temps getting below freezing as early as next week dining is moving completely inside. It’s awful how many people aren’t taking it seriously, and many of my friends are stuck working at places full of the sporadically masked general public just to pay their bills. Very few places can enforce mask rules, most places only allow their staff to ask once nicely and then drop it after too many incidents of assault by crazy assholes.

I know two people personally who tested positive this week, another who just lost their dad to it. Still got invited to two different Thanksgiving celebrations this coming week, each hosted by people who think the election was stolen but can’t quite articulate how. One of whom already almost died of covid. Fucking idiots.

You need to watch this:

https://www.corbettreport.com/lockdowns/

DedalousDiggle 2020-12-05 21:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist (Post 459424)

So there’s a big fucking difference between cancelling cancer treatments and keeping the mall and sports bars open.

Also, as someone whose entire industry has been irreparably damaged by shutdowns (because we literally cannot operate in a way that is safe during a pandemic) and has been living on unemployment insurance since March (now getting weekly what I used to bring home in cash for a decently busy Saturday) I’m well fucking aware of the economic impacts to low income workers by shutdowns.

The responsible thing to do would be to provide direct assistance to those who lost their jobs and small business owners who are unable to keep their doors open. If you inject money at the bottom, people will be able to keep paying their rent, their power bill, their car payment, and keep buying groceries while those at the top will carry on like nothing happened because they’ll still be getting paid. If anyone wants to ask how we could afford that I’d suggest looking at the TRILLION dollar stock market bailout that allowed so many companies to provide their CEOs with massive bonuses and their shareholders with payouts while laying off and fucking over their lowest paid workers.

If you want to throw around “complicit in murder” I would suggest you take up that argument with the families of hundreds of thousands of people who have died from this disease already and with the families of my coworkers, some of whom would be included in that number if no restrictions had been put in place and they had to carry on working like normal in crowded bars and restaurants just so they can keep a roof over their head.

Basically I’m saying you should take that video and shove it up your ass.

Fireball 2020-12-07 00:53

Yeah, I'd really rather we avoid linking to conspiracy theorists and climate change denialists on here.

Hope everyone is as safe as they can be, given the circumstances.

SpaceGuitarist 2020-12-11 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459426)
So there’s a big fucking difference between cancelling cancer treatments and keeping the mall and sports bars open.

Also, as someone whose entire industry has been irreparably damaged by shutdowns (because we literally cannot operate in a way that is safe during a pandemic) and has been living on unemployment insurance since March (now getting weekly what I used to bring home in cash for a decently busy Saturday) I’m well fucking aware of the economic impacts to low income workers by shutdowns.

The responsible thing to do would be to provide direct assistance to those who lost their jobs and small business owners who are unable to keep their doors open. If you inject money at the bottom, people will be able to keep paying their rent, their power bill, their car payment, and keep buying groceries while those at the top will carry on like nothing happened because they’ll still be getting paid. If anyone wants to ask how we could afford that I’d suggest looking at the TRILLION dollar stock market bailout that allowed so many companies to provide their CEOs with massive bonuses and their shareholders with payouts while laying off and fucking over their lowest paid workers.

If you want to throw around “complicit in murder” I would suggest you take up that argument with the families of hundreds of thousands of people who have died from this disease already and with the families of my coworkers, some of whom would be included in that number if no restrictions had been put in place and they had to carry on working like normal in crowded bars and restaurants just so they can keep a roof over their head.

Basically I’m saying you should take that video and shove it up your ass.


My answer is this guy's answer https://www.instagram.com/tv/CIa7T3t...d=yfrrmf5afcqb

DedalousDiggle 2020-12-12 21:49

Glad to see this kind of idiocy isn’t confined to the US.

SpaceGuitarist 2020-12-14 07:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle
Glad to see this kind of idiocy isn’t confined to the US.

So am I. https://youtu.be/pG5xpejUgRQ

johnnybrubacker 2020-12-25 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459426)
So there’s a big fucking difference between cancelling cancer treatments and keeping the mall and sports bars open.

Also, as someone whose entire industry has been irreparably damaged by shutdowns (because we literally cannot operate in a way that is safe during a pandemic) and has been living on unemployment insurance since March (now getting weekly what I used to bring home in cash for a decently busy Saturday) I’m well fucking aware of the economic impacts to low income workers by shutdowns.

The responsible thing to do would be to provide direct assistance to those who lost their jobs and small business owners who are unable to keep their doors open. If you inject money at the bottom, people will be able to keep paying their rent, their power bill, their car payment, and keep buying groceries while those at the top will carry on like nothing happened because they’ll still be getting paid. If anyone wants to ask how we could afford that I’d suggest looking at the TRILLION dollar stock market bailout that allowed so many companies to provide their CEOs with massive bonuses and their shareholders with payouts while laying off and fucking over their lowest paid workers.

If you want to throw around “complicit in murder” I would suggest you take up that argument with the families of hundreds of thousands of people who have died from this disease already and with the families of my coworkers, some of whom would be included in that number if no restrictions had been put in place and they had to carry on working like normal in crowded bars and restaurants just so they can keep a roof over their head.

Basically I’m saying you should take that video and shove it up your ass.


Agree with you 1000%. Crazy that so many people are just so ignorant about this disease. As someone who's working on the frontline (almost) I see so many cases daily. The worst thing now is that these serious cases are in the younger population.
This complicit in murder thing made me chuckle. I think if your family or friends have been affected by the disease then you take a different point of view..... I'm just glad my parents got the vaccine recently.

Streg 2020-12-31 04:24

Hello old friends. Nice to see your familiar names.
It's been a while.
2020 brought me here too. What a year huh?
I'm glad to know you guys are "ok", considering all the stuff that's going on.

Love you all

SpaceGuitarist 2020-12-31 05:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnybrubacker (Post 459499)
Agree with you 1000%. Crazy that so many people are just so ignorant about this disease. As someone who's working on the frontline (almost) I see so many cases daily. The worst thing now is that these serious cases are in the younger population.
This complicit in murder thing made me chuckle. I think if your family or friends have been affected by the disease then you take a different point of view..... I'm just glad my parents got the vaccine recently.

Right, so you're from the UK and in "the frontline". Care to explain this, then? https://www.instagram.com/tv/CJceOyNhH-z/

johnnybrubacker 2020-12-31 21:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist (Post 459511)
Right, so you're from the UK and in "the frontline". Care to explain this, then? https://www.instagram.com/tv/CJceOyNhH-z/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...l-footage.html

Oh this wonderful anti-vaxxer who suggested that the Manchester bombings were "wonderful timing" for Theresa may. Walking around the hospital without a mask?

Yeah it's empty. She's gone to the outpatient department. This non-emergency service has suspended work because of the current crisis as everyone's working and has been redeployed A&E or the wards. But hey it's cool for her to go around walking and filming and for you to repost these truth videos! Keep doing your good work sir!

Here's some more on empty hospitals!

https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4980

:lol:

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-01 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnybrubacker (Post 459513)

Right, but still...

Quote:

The activist was arrested at her home on Tuesday on suspicion of a public order offence where her husband filmed two officers try to handcuff her in her dressing gown.

Sharing the video after being bailed yesterday - and being banned from all NHS property unless she becomes ill - she said: 'Wake up world- how utterly Orwellian and Nazi to go through this for sharing a video of an empty hospital.

'This officer barged into my home, at xmas, and arrested me when I wasn't dressed in front of my family. I was in my nightgown with nothing underneath when the thug of an officer tried to drag me off under arrest as he aggressively arrested me and twisted my hands behind my back in handcuffs'.

Doesn't seem right at all.

Anyway, happy new year y'all, let's hope for more peace this time around!

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-01 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnybrubacker (Post 459513)
Here's some more on empty hospitals!
https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4980

Hmz..

Quote:

“The situation has been compared to field hospitals in active war zones, with several patients being seen and treated whilst still in the backs of ambulances, sharing cubicles in the emergency department, or lining up the corridors due to a lack of space.”

Lack of space, they say? and yet, plentiful of corridors, halls, and the entire outpatient dept. completely empty, without a single soul around as seen on her footage (and like hers, there's plenty other footage circling around of empty hospitals around the world, these videos are popping out everywhere)... These places could be refitted, it's not like this situation is new, we've been into it for a whole year - and it won't be solved anytime soon either.

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-01 18:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnybrubacker (Post 459513)
Keep doing your good work sir!

Thanks, I definitely will, 'cause this entire situation is absolutely sketchy and I encourage every citizen who values his freedom and critical thinking, to do so.

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-02 17:01

Two articles worth appreciating in this new year:

China's COVID-19 ‘success’ is a mirage that continues to deceive the West

Quote:

If there’s one thing we can borrow from China’s *real* response to the pandemic, it’s their post-Wuhan reaction, which showcases that the virus is not powerful enough to even consider a thought about reorienting society around it.
5 countries that are the real COVID-19 ‘success stories’
Quote:

4# Belarus: Belarus strongman Alexander Lukashenko flatly rejected the idea that his country should lock down to “save” his nation from the coronavirus. Instead, Belarus kept society completely open (well, for an authoritarian state, at least), and became one of the few countries in the world to continue professional sports and other events that involved large gatherings.
5# Turkmenistan: In responding to the outbreak, the central asian dictatorship went with the “see no evil say no evil hear no evil” approach. They simply banned the use of the word “coronavirus.” The somewhat comical measure is still much more effective than, say, the liberty crushing, economy destroying lockdowns we saw throughout the rest of the world.

Conclusion:
1) Doing nothing is better than buying into the illusion of control that we must “do something” to stop the spread.
2) “Testing testing testing” leads to panic panic panic.
3) There is still no evidence that there is a way to “stop the spread” and avoid the herd immunity threshold.
:wink2:

Streg 2021-01-03 04:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist (Post 459517)

Those articles have one enormous bias: they assume that the numbers and data these regimes collect are real.

johnnybrubacker 2021-01-03 04:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Streg (Post 459518)
Those articles have one enormous bias: they assume that the numbers and data these regimes collect are real.

He posts a "hmmz" to an article by the British Medical Journal but is happy posting a random guy's blog as validated data. And it's not due to the obesity rates that Korea, Taiwan and japan had low covid numbers. It's because they had an excellent contact tracing system in place so they obsessively tracked any suspected covid cases and tested them. The west didn't listen to Taiwan for obvious political reasons and could've learnt some very important lessons from them.

Also this random blog doesn't mention Sweden's strategy of "not doing anything"...wonder how that worked out....

Here's a link from the MSM aka fake news.

https://www.ft.com/content/d1e581a4-...2-b1a4884c592c

Neko 2021-01-03 11:51

Turkmenistan....a good source??

Isnt the united states a good example of what happens when you do nothing though

Neko 2021-01-03 12:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnybrubacker (Post 459519)
He posts a "hmmz" to an article by the British Medical Journal but is happy posting a random guy's blog as validated data. And it's not due to the obesity rates that Korea, Taiwan and japan had low covid numbers. It's because they had an excellent contact tracing system in place so they obsessively tracked any suspected covid cases and tested them. The west didn't listen to Taiwan for obvious political reasons and could've learnt some very important lessons from them.

Also this random blog doesn't mention Sweden's strategy of "not doing anything"...wonder how that worked out....

Here's a link from the MSM aka fake news.

https://www.ft.com/content/d1e581a4-...2-b1a4884c592c

Hard to argue if the opposite party is convinced regular media, politics and healthcare is by definition not worthy of trust, but every random person speaks truth

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-03 23:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neko (Post 459520)
Turkmenistan....a good source??

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnybrubacker (Post 459519)
He posts a "hmmz" to an article by the British Medical Journal but is happy posting a random guy's blog

Quote:

Originally Posted by Streg (Post 459518)
Those articles have one enormous bias: they assume that the numbers and data these regimes collect are real.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neko (Post 459521)
Hard to argue if the opposite party is convinced regular media, politics and healthcare is by definition not worthy of trust, but every random person speaks truth

It’s the message that’s important, not the messenger*. Up to you if you wish to discredit interesting and valid points that were raised by simply shutting yourself into a "but who has the most credibility? us or them?" rabbit hole.


* P.S.: That "random guy" is Jordan Schachtel, an investigative journalist and foreign policy analyst based in Washington, D.C. And even if he was a "random guy" - think about it, everyone is a random person, every single person on Earth is just a person, we don't have 'galactic Angels who are God-sent virologists from the stars' to tell us the way things are with unquestionable authority, there is no "us vs them", every scientist, doctor or journalist is either hired or independent, and that's the only thing that differs between "opposition" and the "official" information, alternative and mainstream, and my friend, once you snap out of it, you can finally break the illusion and see through.

DedalousDiggle 2021-01-03 23:56

So do this guy’s credentials matter, or not? You cite his qualifications and then say that everyone is just a random person. Obviously there is a difference between an expert in a particular field of study and a random person off the street, but for some reason qualifications only matter when they’re on your side. 99% of medical professionals in the world understand the severity of this pandemic but you choose to focus on the select few weirdos who don’t.

I know you won’t change your mind. You want to be one of few free thinkers, the ones with their eyes open, you want to be special. It’s what has drawn a lot of young men into the Trump camp here, even some of my family. You need to get over it. You’re not on the side of truth and justice, you’re on the side of ignorance and pride.

Neko 2021-01-03 23:59

Don't worry about me, I see through things just fine

Fireball 2021-01-04 06:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Streg (Post 459508)
Hello old friends. Nice to see your familiar names.
It's been a while.
2020 brought me here too. What a year huh?
I'm glad to know you guys are "ok", considering all the stuff that's going on.

Love you all

Hey Streg, happy new year! Hope you're doing okay, all things considered and all that.

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-04 06:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459523)
99% of medical professionals in the world understand the severity of this pandemic but you choose to focus on the select few weirdos who don’t.

I'm certain this percentage is off. The number of 'weirdos' just keeps on growing. In practically every country you'll find whistleblowing doctors and other health workers. If only you look for it - its not going to be spoonfed to you in the media. Heck, if even an entire country like Belarus or Tanzania is doing just fine without all the madness; and these are whole countries albeit small they'd be like a couple of your states in size: that matters a LOT.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459523)
It’s what has drawn a lot of young men (...), even some of my family.

Whelp. Not all hope is lost! :x

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-04 06:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459523)
ignorance and pride.

Ignorance is to never dive into the vast depths of knowledge gathered by those independent from the superficial bubble of mainstream news where you feel comfortable in. You don't have to believe everything; and it's not about changing anyone's mind -- simply an exchange of ideas.

DedalousDiggle 2021-01-04 08:47

The funniest part about all you “free thinkers” is that you pretty much all have the exact same opinions. You also all seem to think that the only two options are that either someone agrees with your crackpot views or they’re just a bunch of sheep who believe whatever “the media” tells them. You can’t possibly think that someone could look at all of the information out there and not agree with you.

I can’t wait to check CNN every morning and find out what my opinions on everything are for the day! I’m just lost without them.

Neko 2021-01-04 13:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459528)
The funniest part about all you “free thinkers” is that you pretty much all have the exact same opinions. You also all seem to think that the only two options are that either someone agrees with your crackpot views or they’re just a bunch of sheep who believe whatever “the media” tells them. You can’t possibly think that someone could look at all of the information out there and not agree with you.

I can’t wait to check CNN every morning and find out what my opinions on everything are for the day! I’m just lost without them.


:lol:

exactly, the truth is complex. And to blindly follow "follow the money" is just as naive as they think other people are :)

I mean if I were Bill Gates, and humor me and let's say what if he truly wants to help the world and the conspiracy theories about him are false. I would definitely fund fact checkers because I would see that false information and ignorance is the biggest issue in fighting disease.

But ofcourse, they turn it around, and say: what does he have to hide?

I am not saying there are no conspiracies or that everything is like the media says. But most people belief the alternative media as blindly as they think we follow regular media.

If we "follow the money", then firefighters are probably causing all fires, since they are the only that benefit from a fire. Hmmm suspisious!

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-04 15:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459528)
The funniest part about all you “free thinkers” is that you pretty much all have the exact same opinions.

The funniest part about all you is that I am simply raising some common sense, valid points for consideration, but none of these matter since they have "no credibility" and apparently "aren't reliable sources" and are tossed into the infamous "fake news" witch burn fire kind of thing, and then, LIKE, right the f*ck after that, you go ranting about how you're receptive to all information but simply dO nOt aGrEe wITh mE. It's actually hilarious.

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-04 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neko (Post 459529)
exactly, the truth is complex.

Whoever said otherwise?

See ya later y'all. :rolleyes:

SpaceGuitarist 2021-01-04 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by DedalousDiggle (Post 459528)
I can’t wait to check CNN every morning and find out what my opinions on everything are for the day! I’m just lost without them.

I wouldn't doubt it! :lol:

Lupin 2021-01-04 17:10

I've been trying to refrain from commenting, but this thread is starting to run a bit on my nerves.

I've had 2 members of my family die in a very painful and lonely way in less than one year because of this virus. My neighbour is an intern in the ICU department of the nearby hospital. He testified to me directly about the unprecedented levels of pressure in there, during the first lockdown, and how it was increasing exponentially until the effects of that lockdown started to show.

Those are first-hand information. SpaceGuitarist, I wonder what you make of it. Do you think I'm lying? Or maybe my neighbour is lying? But for what purpose?

I don't know how you define common sense exactly (you are often calling people to their common sense), so I would rather deduce a number of things from knowledge I know I can trace to reliable foundations:

- Raw data from a large number of different sources about the number of cases in many different countries, regions, etc, all had a roughly exponential shape before the first lockdowns in western countries (A bit less than exponential to be fair, but exponential will do as an approximation). Having multiple unrelated sources ensures that those trends are not made up. If you're gonna argue that point, I'd like if you could make a convincing argument as to how feasible it would be make various websites controlled by different organisations, with data coming from different governments the world over, lie in a consistent way.

- High-school math tells me a bit of how exponential functions behave. What is thousands of severe case one week becomes millions of it a few weeks later if kept unchecked. Try the simple experiment of multiplying a number by 2 successively and see how fast it grows: 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256, 512, 1024, 2048, 4096, 8192, 16384, 32768, 65536, 131072, 262144, 524288, 1048576. Only 20 steps to get from 2 to 1 million!

- Hospitals have a limit to how many patients they can treat at the same time. This limit can grow a bit, but there's no way to fight the power of exponentials. Besides, the limit is not so much about the physical space or medical hardware available, it's more about the number of trained doctors. And you can't train new ones in such a short time. I have no strong evidence to support this point. I'd call that your beloved "common sense". But I'm open to discuss it if you think it doesn't make sense.

- From the previous facts, I can deduce for myself (no need to believe the media) that if nothing is done, past a certain point, the hospitals can't accept new incoming severe cases, and those severe cases remain untreated, which leads to higher death rates. If the number of untreated severe cases is left to reach millions, then you have a serious problem...

Now, are there more effective ways of preventing that from happening than testing, using masks and triggering lockdowns when things get too out of hand?
If there are, I would like to learn about them, because those 3 measures are the ones that seem to make most sense intuitively. Lockdowns are extreme indeed, I think nobody will argue against that, they are a last-resort measure when nothing else works.

I was paying close attention to the numbers for my country last spring before the first lockdown (available ICU beds, number of tracked cases and deaths, etc), making sure to check multiple sources. In fact, one week before the president announced the first lockdown, I was telling my family: "I wonder why aren't they doing it yet?", "Probably trying to preserve the economy at the expense of more deaths...". I drew the exponential curve, it was pointing right up to the millions of death in a few weeks territory. Nobody believed me when I said we couldn't avoid a lockdown. They all said: "oh come on, China is the type of country where they do that, it will never happen here", but it was just obvious by looking at the numbers that we didn't have a better solution. At least I couldn't think of one.

But maybe you have a suggestion regarding that? Or maybe I'm missing some obvious information here?


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 19:27.

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, the Magicball Network