Proposal: Ban ad hominem attacks

[bloodhound]

I've now recognized that a civil discourse on this topic isn't possible with SGK, so I'll leave the points he raised aside. My personal idea is that it's good to avoid offending someone, even if that someone is the only person who would get offended by it, but whatever.

@Battler: I did notice that Germans swear less than Anglophone people, and in contrast to Spain, Germans can get offended when called a son of a bitch because they take that literally and find it unfair to bring their mother into it. Still, we swear a lot more than for example educated rural (or conservative background) Chinese women, who wouldn't even say things like "Fuck that shit". Not sure if it's the same in Japan?
While saying "faggot" and "that's so gay" used to be quite common in 2005, I'd say people now can't say that in contexts where you can't talk about "grabbing 'em by the pussy" either. And I think in these cases, even you as a free speech advocate will agree that it's a good change that people don't use "faggot" and "gay" in random contexts any more.

Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist

I can totally imagine bloodhound in those olden days coming up to Mozart to start stormshitting on him over that.

Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist

Just say "Hey, don't talk to me with that kind of language, okay?" would be enough. And it would end there.

Deal, I'll try that approach next time!

[Polaris]

Originally Posted by Battler

Perhaps they disappeared after World War II?

How would the two be linked ?

[elmuerte]

You can have a long discussion about the etymology of words or phrases. It is how you use them which makes the difference.

[Battler]

- bloodhound: I would have actually preferred had humanity taken the Star Trek approach - no longer getting offended by words. I really recommend that episode where someone from, I believe, the 19th century goes into the future, and calls a black woman a "negress", then quickly apologizes, but she tells him that "they no longer get offended by words".

As for Japan - the problem there is that Japanese doesn't really have any potent swears. But, as I learned the hard way on MSN messenger, simply speaking casual to someone without getting prior permission first, is incredibly offensive. Which is the diametral opposite of modern Germans who outright asked me to drop the "Sie" and use "du" instead when I spoke frmal to them.

Also, we Slovenians seem to be split regarding insults that bring in someone's mother. Half, like myself, treat them as just set expression and don't get particularly riled up, but the other half get very riled up, like Germans, and go like "don't bring my mother into it!". I actually walked once past a bar where the owner got offended at a guy for such a swear phrase, the guy tried to reason with her that it's just a set phrase, but she insisted at taking personal offense at it.

- Polaris: Germans in World War II were basically publicly shamed by the Americans for all the atrocities (see all the newspapers with headlines saying "These atrocities? Your fault!" in German, with photos of the Holocaust mass graves) which may have been what mellowed them down to no longer swear as much.

[bloodhound]

Battler is very right. The reason we Germans stopped using nasty words is because we were trying really hard to please our occupiers and to be their little bitch. If only there was a word for that

@Battler: How would you define "not getting offended by words"? For me it looks like "negress" is just Latin for "black woman" and that's why people in the future don't get offended by it, cool. But why would you prefer that people don't get offended over the terms "faggot" and "that's so gay"? And note also that you yourself became offended by Ben's word choice, for example the word "damsel in distress" for Zoe.

[Battler]

- bloodhound: No, I was offended by Ben's behavior, ie. "Do you have a problem with it?", which looks to me like a threat of adverse consequences for dissent. I have zero problems with the phrase "damsel in distress".

And, as someone who has been called "gay" and "faggot" so many times both in real life (by my classmates in high school) and here (where I've also been called "McFaggot", just ask Reek, for example, who was there as well), I've gotten used to them. I found them more offensive then than I find them now.

And "that's so gay", well, that strongly depends on context. Remember that archically, "gay" meant "pretty" in English and some even recent'ish song lyrics still use it that way (eg. the "gay illumination all around the promenade" in Brighton Rock by Queen certainly wasn't intended to be a "homosexual illumination"). But I do see where you're coming from, though, no, if someone criticized something of mine by calling it "gay", I'd just laugh at that.

Also, from how I understood that black lady's statement in that episode, they no longer get offended by any words, period.

[Polaris]

Originally Posted by Battler

- Polaris: Germans in World War II were basically publicly shamed by the Americans for all the atrocities (see all the newspapers with headlines saying "These atrocities? Your fault!" in German, with photos of the Holocaust mass graves) which may have been what mellowed them down to no longer swear as much.

I understood that it's what you meant, but I fail to see how such a connection could come to be, between swear words and crimes against humanity I mean...

[bloodhound]

Shall we buy Battler a trip to the Bierkönig in Mallorca, which is known as the pinnacle of German politeness?

[SpaceGuitarist]

Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist

Guys !!
Guys !!

The movie I've just watched was awesome !!

IT IS THE STORY OF MBN MEMBERS !

Especially so for people like Battler, but I think many others here, you have to see it, it is a must!

The name is Virgin Mountain (2015)

This was a real suggestion, btw.

[Polaris]

It is sitting on my server, ready to be watched... I'll try to get to it on the weekend.

(Did I mention that I MADE MYSELF A SERVER ??? No, because I keep track of people I mention it to, so that I can be sure I mentioned to everyone that I MADE MYSELF A SERVER !!!)

[SpaceGuitarist]

Originally Posted by Polaris

It is sitting on my server, ready to be watched... I'll try to get to it on the weekend.

(Did I mention that I MADE MYSELF A SERVER ??? No, because I keep track of people I mention it to, so that I can be sure I mentioned to everyone that I MADE MYSELF A SERVER !!!)

A server for... ?

[Polaris]

It currently runs a cloud-like file share (like OneDrive), and a video streamer with which I stream all the films I acquired entirely legally (which may or may not include downloading in Hungary, as there is a law stipulating that you can freely acquire copyrighted files if you don't use them to make money).
I want to install Logitech Media Server, a music streamer program, and hopefully some image and text generating AIs.

[SpaceGuitarist]

Originally Posted by Polaris

It currently runs a cloud-like file share (like OneDrive), and a video streamer with which I stream all the films I acquired entirely legally (which may or may not include downloading in Hungary, as there is a law stipulating that you can freely acquire copyrighted files if you don't use them to make money).
I want to install Logitech Media Server, a music streamer program, and hopefully some image and text generating AIs.

Well it seems there is at least one thing about Hungary that you like.

[Polaris]

Haha
I'll probably leave a raspberry pi or similar to use as a proxy