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General The general chatting goes on in here. That means talk about the LBA games and its world.

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  #26  
Old 2008-08-06, 20:41
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Looking at how hyped up people are, I cant believe I never did an April fools joke

I don't blame you, I get excited sometimes from a 'feeling' that something will be announced.

I did actually send an email to Fred, and one to Didier. Both have the habit of making me wait a month (sometimes 6 months) for a response. I got used to it, and usually just open my inbox not expecting too much!
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  #27  
Old 2008-08-06, 21:03
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axx View Post
Looking at how hyped up people are, I cant believe I never did an April fools joke
And never do one please!

Hmm... what would I do? I think I'd be very happy, have dreams at night related to LBA, play both LBAs again, like the first time (read everything, speak to everyone, etc.), but looking at the number of games by Fred that got cancelled, I'd hope that they would complete and release LBA3.
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  #28  
Old 2008-08-06, 21:27
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Well, to be honest fred completed Poket Castle! But if im correct, somewhere down the line somebody killed it. Fred left F4-Toys, which was producing Trium Planeta (and apparently, continues to do so indefinably), Agartha was canceled by Sega's Mega Failure. All in all, Fred never really canceled his own projects, and If he makes LBA3, I would see no reason to do so.

I would imagine such an april fools joke would probably result in riots that made headlines.
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  #29  
Old 2008-08-06, 21:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axx View Post
Looking at how hyped up people are, I cant believe I never did an April fools joke
that would be a really evil one ;P
(/me notes down to check the date every time axx makes a new thread)
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  #30  
Old 2008-08-06, 22:28
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Originally Posted by Double-J View Post
I'd hope Fred would have the common sense to bring it to the consoles, preferably the Wii, for motion-controller ball throwing.
The Wii cannot hold up the graphics standar for LBA3, seriously.

Maybe the Wii 2. But not the Wii. Anyway it would be could to play any LBA into this console.
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  #31  
Old 2008-08-06, 22:33
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Shit to that.
LBA dosnt need to be anything more graphic intensive then, say, Mario Galaxy.
Heck, dosnt even need to be more advance then Okami. (ok, purhapes a little smoother)

LBA is not a game suitable for high-detailed charecters with normal maps.
Far better to have a good style and quality artistic graphics.

Then again, they made Gears-Of-Beyond-Good-And-Evil, so I wouldnt be supprised if my favorate game is denighed access to the largest install base all for the reason of a style that dosnt even match the universe.
I shudder at a realistic twinsen frankly.
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  #32  
Old 2008-08-06, 22:54
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Originally Posted by Darkflame View Post
Shit to that.
LBA dosnt need to be anything more graphic intensive then, say, Mario Galaxy.
Heck, dosnt even need to be more advance then Okami. (ok, purhapes a little smoother)

LBA is not a game suitable for high-detailed charecters with normal maps.
Far better to have a good style and quality artistic graphics.

Then again, they made Gears-Of-Beyond-Good-And-Evil, so I wouldnt be supprised if my favorate game is denighed access to the largest install base all for the reason of a style that dosnt even match the universe.
I shudder at a realistic twinsen frankly.
I think the same as you. But consider this: LBA3 will be a PC game, that's for sure. Wii versions are not confirmed by a single word of Frédérick Raynal(yet). And LBA3 is going to be in prod (There's a god out there?) in 2009.
Plus, the developers need to think about the graphics, compatibility and stuff to be suitable to the hardware that will see the game out, say 2011 as the minimum release date.
Even if the LBA3 graphics are just average for their time, it will be average for the 2011 PC, not our 2008 machines. Do you think the Wii will compete graphic-wise against a normal PC those days???

Don't be mad at me DarkFlame, I'm not a graphic maniac, in fact most of my favorite games are old-stuff. I just say what I think is going to happen.
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  #33  
Old 2008-08-07, 01:18
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Im not sure what LBA you gies played, but the ones I played were notable at their time for pushing the boundaries of computer graphics. The worlds were detailed, the characters had fluid animations etc...

I would dread to think of LBA on the Wii, or any console for that matter. Fred has said on multiple occassions, it will be for the PC. Personally, Im happy with the direction he will take. LBA to me is a world for me to immerse myself in. Im happy with the styalised status of LBA, but turning it into a surreal graphical game would probably make the experience far more enjoyable.

As for it being like mario galaxy, that game was ugly as hell, and has little resembalance to LBA.

LBA always aimed for surrealism, Mario aimed for cartoonish style



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  #34  
Old 2008-08-07, 10:41
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Trust me, if i knew, you could burn my vocal cords, chop of my hands, gourge my eyes, ill still find a way to tell you it was being made.
Ah... Your wife is typing what you want to say...
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  #35  
Old 2008-08-07, 11:37
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The irony being the screenshots made Mario Galaxy and LBA look much the same style
I also am starting to think more that the fall-off immulation mario galaxy uses could look quite nice with lba too. Just on the charecters though.

Mario galaxy is very pretty, allthough screens rarely do it justice. (for one thing, everyone seems to turn the contrast down and the brightness up Most things look nicer with a full contrast range, that pic dosnt go lower then 30%grey!)

And yes, LBA has always pushed boundarys. As they did with the first Alone in the Dark which was mind-blowing for the time.
The team is/was bloody fine coders which gave great results on moddest specs.

Pushing boundarys does not mean realism, normal maps, or detail though. Thats what it means to, say, ID Software. But its not what it should mean to Adeline.

Thats why I also pointed also to Okami on the ps2 (now wii) to get the message accross.

Thats games many many times more pretty then anything so far seen on the PS3/Xbox360, imo.

Not saying LBA should be doing in that style.
Only that you dont need technical boundarys to push artistic ones. Surrealism, Cartoonism...heck..even Pointalism Id prefer

The barriers to putting LBA on the Wii would purely be self-impossed requirements to do a style the Wii cant do. And that would, basicaly, be graphical realism.
The chipset is decent enough to do various post rendering, it can do many shader layers per pass and does water effects really well. It can even fake lovely atmospherics (Corruption). Its really just normal maps and high poly counts the wii struggles with.

Of course, it could always be the case that a gameplay element prevents a port, and that would be fine.
If technical specs are needed for a specific part of the game to work, then of course the design or flow shouldnt be sacrificed.

But if its just so we can see a few bumps and wrinkles on twinsen because games need to be gritty and realistic now, I'll be quite annoyed.
It will also damage sales.

Quote:
Plus, the developers need to think about the graphics, compatibility and stuff to be suitable to the hardware that will see the game out, say 2011 as the minimum release date.
Even if the LBA3 graphics are just average for their time, it will be average for the 2011 PC, not our 2008 machines.
Its not the machine that makes the graphics though.
Just because a game comes out in a certain year dosnt mean is has too require the hardware from that year.

In takes many manhours to make detailed, realistic, graphics. Larger team sizes mean more cost to develope.
In terms of games these days its developer skill and budget which is the limiting factor.
Hardware dosnt really limit much anymore.

If anything, it just limits developers time because the better the hardware, the less they have to optimise stuff.
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  #36  
Old 2008-08-07, 12:08
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Regarding sales, how more damaged could it get? LBA1 sold 500,000. LBA2 barely made 300,000. That, in the world of computer games, is a drop in the bucket.

I think my point isnt being made very clear

When I say surrealism, I don't mean macho, hardcore looks, or funky hairdo. I mean, what would twinsen look like, if you met him in person(provided he exists).

The style of mario world are too cute, and too uninteresting. Theyre designed for the gameplay. LBA is quite a deep game, and the cute graphics (worlds, not characters) do it no good.

The original lba has cold icy environments, you could see vehicle tread marks on the ice, you could see snow building up on the huts etc... LBA2 had the undergas, detailed (relativley) textures in cafe's of desert island etc...

If you were to switch that for mario world, then you'll notice quite a difference at that point. The arnt the same. At first glance, maybe, but LBA is from 1997, mario world came a decade later, yet lba has more detail despite the limitations of its time. I was making the point of lba aiming to be detailed, while mario deliberatly not.

Also, look what cute did for Wind Walker? Thats what it did for LBA.
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  #37  
Old 2008-08-07, 19:35
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Are you saying LBA2 was too cute and they should put less colors in LBA3 ?
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  #38  
Old 2008-08-07, 19:38
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What about having the kind of graphics that The Banjoo game for xbox 360 have :P
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  #39  
Old 2008-08-07, 20:23
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I just hope it isn't as realistic as this:
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  #40  
Old 2008-08-08, 00:40
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Yeah, imagine how weird quetches would look with that kind of detail, it would ruin it for me.
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  #41  
Old 2008-08-08, 12:25
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regarding the reaction, i think i would collapse (?) for sure i will cry ot loud and hug and kiss everyone around me, even the cat thoug i am alergic to them, then i would pass the entire day posting at the MBN, and i would buy beers, chips, pringles, whatever to celebrate..
definetively it would be one of the best news of my entire life..
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  #42  
Old 2008-08-08, 16:24
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well surely someone should organize a super meeting for that
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  #43  
Old 2008-08-08, 17:20
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I would raise my eyebrow cautiously.

Ofcourse, if a release date was announced, then I would probably die of shock. But die happy.
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  #44  
Old 2008-08-08, 18:52
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well surely someone should organize a super meeting for that
Yeah, with the creators too...

About the style, I would like a style like LBA2's cut scenes with some improvements. Many details, but the same cartoonish look'n'feel.
Although, I hope they don't focus too much on the graphics cause nowdays it's different. Back in 1994/1997 you needed talent more than budget to push the boundaries. Now you need money and a huge team to do that. But what's the point ?

I really hope they don't increase the team size, or not too much.
That would kill the magic. Small teams make human games. As Fred said in an interview, a small team is like a music band, everyone plays his instrument and each person's personality influences the style of the band. Big teams can make good things, but they can't transcend you !
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  #45  
Old 2008-08-09, 03:28
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Actually, some of my favorite games did have large development teams, and they still had 'the magic'.

They started with a small group, then became ambitious, hired on a huge bunch of mooks so they had enough hands for the work at hand. But essentially this means that what you have is this huge group fulfilling the vision of a handful of people who are keeping a close eye on whats being done. I think any LBa game being developed now would have a similar structure, precisly to retain that magic. Frederick, unlike many games developoers, has always struck me as someone who knows how to make a good game, as opposed to someone who doesn't have a clue but makes a good one by accident every decade or so (I'm looking at you Bethesda!)

So it can work with a large development team.
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  #46  
Old 2008-08-09, 09:31
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LBA3 will look very different so I don't know how i'll react, just being LBA is enough for me though. The LBA style is practically based on the graphical limitations of the time, the look of the CGI characters was carried over from 1994 so if it's ever released, it's going to be much more polished and interesting.

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As for it being like mario galaxy, that game was ugly as hell, and has little resembalance to LBA.
What.
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  #47  
Old 2008-08-09, 09:50
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Originally Posted by Ravey View Post
LBA3 will look very different so I don't know how i'll react, just being LBA is enough for me though. The LBA style is practically based on the graphical limitations of the time, the look of the CGI characters was carried over from 1994 so if it's ever released, it's going to be much more polished and interesting.


What.
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Originally Posted by Axx View Post
Regarding sales, how more damaged could it get? LBA1 sold 500,000. LBA2 barely made 300,000. That, in the world of computer games, is a drop in the bucket.
Both games outsold Beyond Good and Evil, production costs were probably higher too.
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  #48  
Old 2008-08-09, 09:56
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If I'm right LBA2 cost around 2 million dollars to be made.

That means: 300.000 units * $30 (standar price) = 9 million dollars.

They got some profit after all.

=)
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  #49  
Old 2008-08-09, 11:02
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There are many fans out there, I think, who couldn't get a licensed copy... Makes me wonder: LBA is still sought after these days. They should re-issue, adapted for modern computers.

All the talk of a 'new look' for LBA makes me uneasy. =) Am too deeply attached to the LBA1 style. But, hey, I guess no matter what LBA3 might be like, it's LBA.
Wish I see this happening in my lifetime. =)
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  #50  
Old 2008-08-10, 01:17
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I think this new look is simply going to be the same visual style we got from LBA1 and 2, but after 12 or so years (By the time we have a release date, being optmistic) of technological advancement.

So imagine LBA1, but prettier.
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