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  #1  
Old 2006-03-11, 14:07
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schitzn schitzn is offline
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WOW Me [Part 1/10]

For those of you who r like me, ur a programmer, software engineer or if ur not like me, a GEEK, I hope you find some pleasure in me presenting some amazing pieces of programming art.

Over the next ten days, Im going to throw some of my favourite works for you to download and experience.

What are they?
Their programs designed to give an experience!
Whats so special about them?
Some of them are addictive due to their creative flaw, some of them are purely impressive because of the size of them and the funkiness they omit.
So, without adieu, let here be the first of ten for me to present.




Its called BEYOND

http://users.bigpond.net.au/schitzn/...yond_Final.exe

Why is it cool??
-> Its less than 64 Kb , thats 65,536 bytes in size
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  #2  
Old 2006-03-11, 15:04
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beautiful.
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  #3  
Old 2006-03-11, 15:48
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Sorry, its my legal duty to post this before anyone else does:
http://kk.kema.at/files/kkrieger-beta.zip

Thank you

Also with this program you can make your own tiny music sycned "demo" things relatively easily:
http://www.scene.org/file.php?file=%...0.zip&fileinfo

Fantastic thread

With so called amataurs comeing up with stuff like this it really shows theres NO EXCUSE for companys needing multiple-disc games.
Multi-Gigabyte installs should not be the norm.
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  #4  
Old 2006-03-11, 16:50
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Holy fucking mother of ... How the fuck is that 48kb, im impressed as fuck! Id love to see the source code!
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  #5  
Old 2006-03-11, 17:08
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Its really cool, but are you sure it won't grab nothing from the web to play all that? :week:
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  #6  
Old 2006-03-11, 17:17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkflame
With so called amataurs comeing up with stuff like this it really shows theres NO EXCUSE for companys needing multiple-disc games.
Multi-Gigabyte installs should not be the norm.
Scene members are not amateurs. And there is a good excuse for "multiple-disc", cramping data into algorithms takes a lot of time.
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  #7  
Old 2006-03-11, 19:36
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Fantastic! This is one of the best features that has been demonstrated in programs!
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  #8  
Old 2006-03-11, 19:57
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Quote:
Scene members are not amateurs. And there is a good excuse for "multiple-disc", cramping data into algorithms takes a lot of time.
They arent paid to do what they do, hence i called them "so called amateurs".

Do you mean time to develop? Or time to load? (ie, rendering out the procedural information into ram?)

I dont believe development time would be effected, much, if at all.
3DS Max, Maya and just about every other 3D software already uses many procedural textures for making renders.
Game engines simply don't support them.

Making new procedural algorithms takes time, but I imagine that developers would build up an archive of common ones to use, or that engines/graphic cards could have loads built in.
(Much like sound cards contain 'fonts' of sounds, graphic cards could potential contain a pallete of procedral functions)

If this ever happened, development time would actually decrease.
Rather then modeling grass and manualy positioning them on an enviroment, they tell the game "grass, this colour, this density" then spray it on.
And the game dosnt store all the vertexs and colour information, instead it just stores the information needed to make it.

Because the data isnt fixed down, random varitations could be put in more easily for increased realism.

And, when the CPUs/GPUs get powerful enough, you could render the textures off on the fly...having infinite detail.

I acknowledge at the moment, rendering procedural to textures in ram takes longer loading times.

However, I'm not talking about getting games in <1MB, but I merely think we have gone to the other extreme.
I bet just about every game with MultiGiga install files could be cut down 10fold with a bit of thought,or a more procedurally-minded design approach.
(or better at streaming infomation...)
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  #9  
Old 2006-03-11, 20:31
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Axx, in the SPORE thread I posted some links to the scene intros and demos, including some really spectacular ones from 2005.
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  #10  
Old 2006-03-11, 20:48
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Erm, I can't open this file at all. It just opens for a fraction of a second, then immediately closes.
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  #11  
Old 2006-03-11, 21:43
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Amazing to see all that in a 64k file! Great work man!!
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  #12  
Old 2006-03-12, 07:23
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Spore, currently in development by Maxis, as mentioned by Jasiek is taking the approach Darkflame mentioned.

Quote:
For inspiration, Wright [Game Designer who made Maxis] looked to the "demo scene," a group of (mostly European) coders who specialized in doing a whole lot with a little bit of code. Their procedural programming methods were able to, for example, fit an entire 3D game in 64K, using mathematics to generate textures and music, etc. "I just found this incredibly exciting," Wright confesses, describing the kinds of work that he saw come out of the demo scene.
Thats from a GameSpy interview with Will Wright, creator of The Sims, Simcity series, Maxis.


I think large games on multi CD/DVD's are another mechanism for copy-protection to prevent easy leeching. It works hand-in-hand with the benefit of using minimal development time and not optimizing code/movies/audio/gfx for size.
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  #13  
Old 2006-03-12, 07:40
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Morshem:
Quote:
Erm, I can't open this file at all. It just opens for a fraction of a second, then immediately closes.
Do you have the latest DirectX? Whats your system specs (OS, CPU, Videocard)?

Quote:
I understand if they somehow stuck all the graphical part in there, but how did they manage to stuff inside the music aswell?
Some techniques include MIDI streams, instead of raw audio data such as WAVE/MP3, a MIDI file is like a musical sheet that plays a keyboard on your soundcard for different instrumental sounds and frequencies.

Another common technique is to create all the audio at runtime (when the user starts the software), by creating sounds based from algoritms, and then running a DJ LIKE setup to play different beats/sounds at different times making a full musical score.

DirectX has DirectSound, which is a big equalizer that lets developers morph sounds which allows really cool sound effects with minimal code.

Quote:
Its really cool, but are you sure it won't grab nothing from the web to play all that?
You could try disconnecting your modem and see if it starts without an internet connection
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  #14  
Old 2006-03-12, 07:42
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Moses Christ

I still claim this kind of thing can't possibly fit in 48kb. No matter what you'll say, it just isn't possible. The properties of the file are lying
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  #15  
Old 2006-03-12, 08:09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosFish
I still claim this kind of thing can't possibly fit in 48kb.
It most likely dumps 128+ Mb of textures into the ram.
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  #16  
Old 2006-03-12, 09:46
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The executables are also compressed, usualy the size is reduced to about 30%
The actual executable would be 3 times as large tho 144kb is still small. And ofcourse it relies on directx and opengl (which have a couple of MB overhead). For the rest it's a bunch of algorithms.
The people of .kkrieger (farbrausch) made one of their design tools available: http://www.theprodukkt.com/werkkzeug1.html
note that it took a couple of years to create that tool.

Here are a lot more of farbrausch demos: http://www.farbrausch.de/
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  #17  
Old 2006-03-12, 11:32
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That first file was beautiful. Can't believe it's so small.
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  #18  
Old 2006-03-12, 12:28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CS2x
That first file was beautiful. Can't believe it's so small.
Yeah I mean, I know AVATARS which are twice as large as that file
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  #19  
Old 2006-03-12, 12:42
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I do now understand. You mean to say apllying math might drasticly reduce bytesize of games? wow...


is it like applying everything into a loop like: for i < 7, i ++,
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  #20  
Old 2006-03-12, 13:34
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it will reduce
- diskspace
- flexibility

it will increase
- loading times
- development time
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  #21  
Old 2006-03-12, 18:22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schitzn
Morshem:

Do you have the latest DirectX? Whats your system specs (OS, CPU, Videocard)?
I have version 9.0 of DirectX I think (at least there's no update available at Windows Update). I use Windows XP Pro SP1, and an NVIDIA GeForce 4 MX 440 video card. What do you mean by CPU?
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  #22  
Old 2006-03-12, 21:54
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processor speed I think.
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  #23  
Old 2006-03-12, 22:39
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CPU = Central Processing Unit

Well, can you compress any clip like that or u made a special codec(or wtf its called) that specializes on space thingies?
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  #24  
Old 2006-03-20, 13:08
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Woooooow Das Da Mostest Amazing Shing I've Evva Seen!!!! Howjudodat?
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  #25  
Old 2006-03-20, 13:08
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Visit the "Here's Spore" thread, to see how things could be in games .
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