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Little Script Adventure An open-source 3D engine with assets and tools for all future LBA fan-games.

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  #2726  
Old 2011-10-27, 18:50
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Jasiek Jasiek is offline
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Maybe let's replace non-transparent textures with jpg's then? Should load way faster.
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  #2727  
Old 2011-10-27, 18:56
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how can you say this ?
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  #2728  
Old 2011-10-27, 19:08
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Well if it will improve loading times...
Wouldn't be really happy about it... but if it needs to be done then so be it...
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  #2729  
Old 2011-10-27, 20:26
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David, you can just optimize the code: I'm pretty sure current resource pipeline should work much faster. However, if you want to improve loading speed with more radical methods, try to reduce number of required data conversions.
For example, like in most games, textures can be compressed using S3TC. Although that compression method is lossy (unlike PNG), you get several advantages: since GPU decompresses S3 textures on-the-fly, you use less bandwidth and video memory and reduce CPU load, since you just copy compressed texture data straight into video memory.
Another option will be converting models to binary format, so you don't need to parse a ton of text each time you start LSA (screw human readability, noone is going to read them anyway).

Of course I understand that change of data formats may be a bit unpleasant, so I suggest to create a certain pre-build procedure. SVN repo will contain raw data - text-based models, PNG textures, source code. Anybody who wishes to try running a development version must run build script that will compile source code into an executable and convert all resources into production-ready format.
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  #2730  
Old 2011-10-28, 00:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasiek View Post
And I'd really like to have grass sprites placed randomly on faces with a grass texture, with a random flower here and there. Grass sprites should be _transp.
I think I know the perfect resource for this:

http://translate.google.com/translat...-tutorial.html


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Originally Posted by Jasiek View Post
And Horadrim about the prison I was thinking - we'll have a pretty radical departure from what was present in LBA1/2 in terms of level design outside - how about "smoothing" things out in the prison? Change it a bit, roound the corners, add more but smaller cells and add some prisoners in straitjackets in there - maybe ditch the "disappearing ceiling" concept and move the rooms a bit - there's plenty of unused space in there. Darken it up a bit I guess - or make it more "white and sterile" - akin to a WW1 hospital.
To be honest, I was thinking the same thing for a long time now. The problem is that I`m starting to make too much things at once and this leads to nothing. I mean - starting to think about and make a model(s) of something, then leave the whole concept and starting something other is not too helping to the project. I will remodel it and actually I already got some nice ideas, inspired from movies/games and even pictures. Let`s use the current model just for now, for testing purposes, meanwhile I`ll finish the rest of the stuff I started, then I`ll move again on the prison. I think this kind of practice will tidy up the work and won`t jam it.


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Originally Posted by ambient View Post
Another option will be converting models to binary format, so you don't need to parse a ton of text each time you start LSA (screw human readability, noone is going to read them anyway).

Of course I understand that change of data formats may be a bit unpleasant, so I suggest to create a certain pre-build procedure. SVN repo will contain raw data - text-based models, PNG textures, source code. Anybody who wishes to try running a development version must run build script that will compile source code into an executable and convert all resources into production-ready format.
I think that this is very wise suggestion. I`m really concerned about what will happen if we need to add more models in one place. It`ll take eons to load a level and will become very irritating to the player (i.e. the new DeusEx is capable of stretching tight your nerves to the maximum, while loading a zone).
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  #2731  
Old 2011-10-28, 15:13
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For the compression, I'll think about it. Remember we can zip SMD and OBJs to accelerate loading time. PNGs are already a zipped type files.

Also time needed for prerendering will be removed cause I plan to use real time skinning.

Finally I would say most of PNGs could be resize like 1/4 of their original size and you wouldn't see the difference if not using really close camera angle, which is our case I guess.

I've added picking buffer output, Not sure you really need it but display is funny.

Picking and camera moving should work as before now, I added a limitation to camera speed while navigating, sure it's frustrating, but to me it's even more frustrating to have the scene disappear suddenly while scrolling with low angle camera.
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  #2732  
Old 2011-10-28, 15:50
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The selection does not work well now. I can hardly select and object.
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  #2733  
Old 2011-10-28, 17:16
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should work now
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  #2734  
Old 2011-10-28, 17:26
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I added same system while moving objets, they won't disappear so fast now
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  #2735  
Old 2011-10-28, 19:42
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It`s still the same. What did you do? I can`t select anything :S . The only way to select (and does not work all the time), is drag select.

Last edited by Horadrim; 2011-10-28 at 19:51.
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  #2736  
Old 2011-10-29, 00:59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
For the compression, I'll think about it. Remember we can zip SMD and OBJs to accelerate loading time. PNGs are already a zipped type files.
Also time needed for prerendering will be removed cause I plan to use real time skinning.
You haven't quite understood the point of my post - "try to reduce number of required data conversions". Zipping everything means that you need to unzip it back during loading (and that means additional computing effort), so it will do exactly the opposite: loading time will increase instead of decreasing. Either use cheap compression or use no compression at all.

And yeah, precomputing animations was a damn stupid idea. I'm not sure why you suddenly decided to use it.
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  #2737  
Old 2011-10-31, 15:28
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Who are you to say I'm stupid ?
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  #2738  
Old 2011-10-31, 19:06
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Quote:
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Who are you to say I'm stupid ?
I was talking about the idea itself. Everybody makes mistakes sometimes, I didn't mean to be offensive.
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  #2739  
Old 2011-11-02, 12:19
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I did implement this technic to have lots of bots on GPUs where HW skinning was not possible, see before the "army" of grobos.
I will keep SW/HW skinning but without pre rendering, since I actually don't care about performances on old GPUs

picking should work
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  #2740  
Old 2011-11-02, 12:35
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Yay! It really works now.
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  #2741  
Old 2011-11-02, 14:55
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so what's the next step ? Do you have all the materials you need ? Any map in perspective ?
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  #2742  
Old 2011-11-02, 16:31
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As Jasiek mentioned, the prison needs some remodelling. I started to gather some resources and ideas, but I wonder what to start first. I already made some plans about the snowy regions. The truth is that I`d like to make all at once . Do you still need some stuff for the underwater?
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  #2743  
Old 2011-11-02, 16:37
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To my mind having the icy region on the repo would be much more motivating than seing a remodeling of the prison, because it gives me the feeling that project is going forward and also it anticipates feature we'll need such as those special materials
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  #2744  
Old 2011-11-02, 19:24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
To my mind having the icy region on the repo would be much more motivating than seing a remodeling of the prison, because it gives me the feeling that project is going forward and also it anticipates feature we'll need such as those special materials
Perhaps you should choose a bit more "functional" region to model first - to start implementing non-graphics stuff. Icy maps are quite static, iirc.
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  #2745  
Old 2011-11-02, 19:35
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yeah, I want to work on the graphics part for now, I was thinking about adding snow effect for example
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  #2746  
Old 2011-11-02, 20:06
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By snow effect you mean the snowflakes snowing or the nice glimmer of the snow? BTW, did you see the grass rendering stuff I posted after Jasiek`s post? He wanted random grass & flowers placement. The above article is just for this and since it`s from the same source I got the sky & clouds demos, I believe it`s worthy resource. What do you think?
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  #2747  
Old 2011-11-02, 23:21
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yeah snowflakes, could be a second experiment after the plasma one.
For the grass I prefer the block of 3 faces, with no camera alignment. And you ? For random placement what about doing it with blender or MAX ? I did it for shells in harbor map
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  #2748  
Old 2011-11-02, 23:31
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The block is good idea, the camera alignment is a bit outdated technique IMO. I thought that you`d be interested in the grass rendering article, there`s a part with animating the grass too, it`ll be very nice.
As for the MAX random object distribution, yes, it`s possible with the scatter tool. I did the minabea "flowers" this way.
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  #2749  
Old 2011-11-03, 00:13
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moving the grass with a vertex shader should be easy, with a perlin noise function. The shader they use is clear, so you can count on it. Since the editor work again and you made some algae blocks, I could use such a shader for them on ocean floor. Or maybe you already created such a map, with the minabea corals ?
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  #2750  
Old 2011-11-03, 10:34
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I asked you if you need more underwater props, because I`m not sure if these I made already are enough. We could always have some underwater maps, but since it`ll be off the story, I`m not sure if sparing time for such thing is worthy. If you and Jasiek are OK with this, we could add some brand new elements. Why not even giving Twinsen a diving suit?
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