Main Discussion

[Jasiek]

I wonder what is it that all the stuff you write has... cause no matter if it's your viewer or the LSA it will run under wine, but display a black screen, but then show me the content for a split second before exiting when I hit escape. Maybe there's something in your code?

Of course I don't want you to waste your time on trivial stuff like that . But anyway, apart from having a native linux version, having one compatible with wine would also be great. Cause it runs, just has a black screen over it, which shows you the game runs ok (the camera even changes accordingly to what I blindly pressed) just before you exit.

[Kobold]

The camera auto-focus is always hindering me. The pharmacy gets in the line of sight when entering the maze. I know you can change the zoom with the mouse button, but adjusting the vertical angle would be nice.

[David]

Kobold : Do you know you can change vertical angle and perspective with the two sliders ?

Hep, my bots are escaping !
1- launch application
2- go drink a coffee
3- when you come back, they have disappeared !!!

[Rincevent_123]

This is pretty nice work in there!
The path finding of your bots seems to work well.

But for the camera I have the same opinion that Kobold it is easy to get lost.

A way to avoid this problem could be that you remove or make transparent everything which is between the camera and the main character. But this is not so easy to do.

Another way as I actually use in my engine would be to draw your complete scene once, then redraw your main character on the top with z-buffer disabled and with a 50% transparency. This is a cheap and dirty way but at least the user always see the main character wether it is behind a wall or not.


Rincevent

[Bot13]

I'm getting a msvcrt.dll error with the new executable. The old one works fine.

[Kobold]

Originally Posted by david38

Kobold : Do you know you can change vertical angle and perspective with the two sliders ?

Hep, my bots are escaping !
1- launch application
2- go drink a coffee
3- when you come back, they have disappeared !!!

What sliders? I haven't seen any.

[David]

Kobold : these sliders
Bot 13 : did you try adding that DLL in exec folder ?

[David]

can any mod move that thread to fan games ?

edit : thanks for the quick action !

[David]

I'm almost done making LSA V2 linux compatible !

[David]

nothing really new apart :
- linux version !
- pressing 'r' will randomize following bot position. Good for pathfinding tests.
- fps display works worst ! (will correct that)

[Jasiek]

It's beyond awesome !

I see two things wrong though... first one is with the collision, meaning he doesn't climb slopes and the pharmacy "upper floor" floor is passable.

And the second one is a suggestion for the path finding AI. The one following you should back up a bit if you walk towards his general direction, and also start running if you do, now they run after you when the distance between you two is really large. And the ones walking freely should try to avoid you, stop if you're in their way for a while, and then try to walk around you (so you can in essence be able to talk to walking NPC's ).

[Darkflame]

If the new engine was tilebased, you could do a fairly simple trick to get walking up/down levels working. (just specify the height at the edge of each tile, then change from one Z value to the other based on how far twinsen is from it).

A non-tile based engine makes it tricker I think.
I never had to do it myself, as the one time I did something that needed it I was using DarkBasicPro, and that had a function built in. (the function basicaly found the distance downwards till you intersect with a polygon...thus making it easy to place stuff on a surface).

[David]

jasiek : combining pathfinding and collision between bots is out of my knowledge. Maybe if an expert in collision comes to that thread I'll do it.
I could deal with non flat maps, only if for one given (X,Y) point one the map, there is only one possible Z. The reason is easy, that would mean 3D AI / path finding.
In short, no bridges (unless you can only walk on top if it) nor lifts.
Scales otherwise could be added.

[Jasiek]

Well, elevators, slopes and bridges are a must as they are featured in LBA1.
NPC's stopping when you move in front of them is also a must, I don't think I have to say why... chasing after them trying to talk to them would be really annoying.

Here's some character models:
http://www.sendspace.com/file/qyelkt

Now, I don't have the time to animate them, or learn how to do that in Blender for that matter. So, if you're up to it, download yazors character viewer so you can see the original animations. The Grobos should walk slightly bent forwards, so they look a bit angry. The trunk should move to the left and right when they sit.

I'll send you the soldier rifle when I have found it. Their standing animation should be to stand straight like soldiers do, with their rifle on their palm propped on their arm. They should occasionally march in place, move their head left and right and salute from time to time.

The salesman should walk around slouched, looking sad and exhausted. Also, it's an older model I made, so it's not a closed mesh, if you need it to be a closed one let me know and I'll work on it.

The regular grobo should wave his ears a bit when standing, like real elephants do.

I have also included the textures for the green and red grobo variants.

[David]

Thanks man, that's really nice from you to share all these models with the community. I'll be happy to animate it even if I'm far to be good at it.
You can always modify models even after they are included in game, cause it's very easy to update it with those python scripts.
By now I wish you can finish the outdoor of the pharmacy, also the walls need to be "closed".
For slopes no problems. But elevators and multiple stair structures can dramatically make things complicated. Don't you think it's better to keep that engine easy and thus more readable ? Don't you think it's better to develop gameplay, scenarios, dialogs rather than looking for a complex engine nobody will use ?
Let's say making NPC stop is already done, it's adding only one line of code.

[Jasiek]

Well of course it should be easy!
I'm just saying from the perspective of a person who wants to continue my remake using your engine. And a lot of places in LBA1 have elevators. The prison and such. Even the sewer entrences.

Also, the library has two floors.

[David]

The community should decide in which direction goes LSA !
Here are two points of view
1) I think your point of view is clear : LSA should be a clone of LBA
2) Mine is that LSA should let users write simple Lua scripts, only playing with X,Y coordinates. Even if it's not a clone of LBA, it has its feeling and is more accesible to people who don't know about coding.
3) anybody wants to give his point of view ??

[Darkflame]

I dont think it should be just a clone of LBA, but imho, some form of multi-level support is very needed.

Maybe theres premade code about for positioning characters in the z axis to the mesh under them?
So people writting Lua scripts done need to worry about z, but the charecter still can move up/down hills.

Id like, if possible, for this engine to be used for remakes, fan games, psydo-sequals, and completely unrelated but similar styled games.

[Jasiek]

I don't think it should be a clone, but it at least should give the same functionality LBA1 has regarding to level design. At least, that's why I'm into this.

[David]

Originally Posted by Darkflame

I dont think it should be just a clone of LBA, but imho, some form of multi-level support is very needed.

Maybe theres premade code about for positioning characters in the z axis to the mesh under them?
So people writting Lua scripts done need to worry about z, but the charecter still can move up/down hills.

Id like, if possible, for this engine to be used for remakes, fan games, psydo-sequals, and completely unrelated but similar styled games.

As I said before, one stair level doesn't mean flat level. As long as there is one possible Z for one (X,Y), the engine can do the job, Z becomes transparent to user when writing Lua script.

More members opinion needed here !

[Darkflame]

Whats the problem with more then one possible z then?
I was thinking the engine would take the charecters current z value, and look down from that value at the players x/y the first collision with a poly to get its new one when moving.
I'm probably missing something, but that should work for multiple levels like bridges.

Allthough it wouldnt work for elivators/platforms

[Kitarii]

Originally Posted by david38

The community should decide in which direction goes LSA !
Here are two points of view
1) I think your point of view is clear : LSA should be a clone of LBA
2) Mine is that LSA should let users write simple Lua scripts, only playing with X,Y coordinates. Even if it's not a clone of LBA, it has its feeling and is more accesible to people who don't know about coding.
3) anybody wants to give his point of view ??

Why not Z as well? To have stairs and elevators and all sorts of upward movement in general?
I think it would be a lot better anyway.

[David]

Originally Posted by Darkflame

Whats the problem with more then one possible z then?
I was thinking the engine would take the charecters current z value, and look down from that value at the players x/y the first collision with a poly to get its new one when moving.
I'm probably missing something, but that should work for multiple levels like bridges.

Allthough it wouldnt work for elivators/platforms

the problem is not collision detection, but path finding (AI), platform mechanism, scene description, and actually game scripting in general.

[David]

Originally Posted by Kitarii

Why not Z as well? To have stairs and elevators and all sorts of upward movement in general?
I think it would be a lot better anyway.

Of course it's better, but makes it harder to level designer to create maps. You choose !

[Kitarii]

Maybe, but surely it would be worthwhile?