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  #76  
Old 2003-08-24, 21:18
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Twinsal Twinsal is offline
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You're right about that, but it doesn't matter. Like you said, they are doing good in the other markets. They still bought their place.
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  #77  
Old 2003-08-25, 01:41
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Quote:
Sony did NOT have a monopoly, the eletronics market (which is Sony's market) is extremely competitive and a monopoly is something very hard to get in it. Monopoly = Microsoft, where 90% of computers run Windows. But certainly not 90% of houses have Sony TVs. There's Philco, Matsushita, Panasonic, LG, Samsung, Sharp, Aiwa, Siemens, and others. Sony did good in that market, but they certainly were not a monopoly.
err...I was talking about Music you blockhead
And yes, actualy, in spacific hardware they do have a monopoly (Walkman, Discman ect... there name has in fact BECOME the names for those devices, even the non-sony ones)


Quote:
Yes but sony did very well in her previous industries, and they wanted to get into the video gaming industry.
Companies want to succeed, you know.
There's nothing wrong with that.
Yes, there is.
The logical progression of your view is the world would be left with one company.
You think thats "correct" or "nothing wrong" with it?

If I make billions of pounds saleing trainers does that give me the right to put a load of bakers out of buisness?

Please thing about this hard.

Companys spreading are dangerious.

Quote:
Globalization is dangerous because it concentrates supplies and\or resourcres and\or authority in one place.
Thus, allowing them to do whatever they please.
Not really, thats the side-effects of globalization.
In its purest form, in simply means one company trading world-wide. World wide trade and markets are a good thing.

However, unfortunatly, it normaly ends in an over centralised company, exploting the bits it cant see.
Most people arnt "evil", as such.
But the people that make up a company often do evil things because they dont see the places where there things are made. (ie trainers)
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  #78  
Old 2003-08-25, 02:03
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But they invented Discmen, so.
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  #79  
Old 2003-08-25, 03:04
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Quote:
Originally posted by Twinsal
You're not getting DF's point. Nintendo only has their console(s) and games and therefor not as much influence as Microsoft, a company which only has a console to make fast money. (they didn't expect to lower prices like this)

And maybe you don't think Nintendo is original, but they certainly are. They always try to bring something new, or give a sequal a right to exist.
If we're talking about originality in games, then Sony has had some original ideas in the past as well.
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  #80  
Old 2003-08-25, 07:40
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Sony has just made 1 game! 1 single game! Tell me, in the games industry, what did they came up with?
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  #81  
Old 2003-08-25, 11:04
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Darkflame - your definition of globalization it utopic.
It's "side effecs" are simply human nature.
It cannot be avoided.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist
This is work of higher intelligences, who take other, esoteric and psychological sciences into account than we are normally used to even consider, numerology being one of them, because everything for them is ritualistic and everything is meant for a deep programming of our psychological state. One day witchcraft and science will collide.
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  #82  
Old 2003-08-25, 15:38
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No, it isnt.
The thing about all global companys being evil is a myth.
Its a sterotype.
Some are, yes, most are, maybe.

But their not evil BECAUSE they are global.

Quote:
Originally posted by Medur
But they invented Discmen, so.
I have no problem with that at all, they should be successfull because of a good invention, sure.
But NOT in another market place.

Why is this so hard for people to understand?

Not one person seems to "get" the idea that buiness spreading like that are very bad for inovation and compition.

Quote:
If I make billions of pounds saleing trainers does that give me the right to put a load of bakers out of buisness?
===
Fireball ~ Your quite wrong.
Sony literaly hasnt invented or developed any gameplay improvements *at all*.
Name one single thing they have done in software or hardware that is an inovation!

Literaly NOTHING.

The best thing they have made in the last decade or so is probably the "eye toy" gadget, and even that might just be a rip-off of a clever device I saw in the GAMEON exhibition a few years back.
And even if they did it themselfs (which I dought), thats recent, no inovations in consoles before that at all.
As for software, thats a flat "0"

How people can tell me they deserve to be in the market is beyond me.
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  #83  
Old 2003-08-25, 19:59
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Df: That's not true! They made 1 game, Mark of Kri. It is quite good.
But further, nothing. Absolute 0.

Jeey, VJ doesn't go PS2!
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It kept me sane for a couple of years
As it drenched my fears
Of becoming like the others
Who become unhappy mothers
And fathers of unhappy kids
And why's that?
'Cause they've forgotten how to play
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  #84  
Old 2003-08-25, 20:27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Darkflame
Why is this so hard for people to understand?

Not one person seems to "get" the idea that buiness spreading like that are very bad for inovation and compition.
I don't agree.
Dude, business are like that. You can ask anyone who is studying merchandising, publicity or economy. A company simply wants to expand more and more. The video-games market was attractive and possible for Sony, so they got into it. They don't have to "deserve" to be in it: and the simply proof is that they are in it. Anyone can make a console and try to publish it. If people buy it, it's their fault. Squaresoft tried to expand to the market of movies, for an example. That happens in any market, not just video-games. It's not hard to see companies that started as coffee shops but became shopping malls.
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  #85  
Old 2003-08-26, 15:14
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just because it happens dosnt mean its right

They *should* have to deserve to be in it.
Does it give me the right to murder someone simply because I have? Of course not...your argument "its ok, because they have done it" is nonsense. Just as "its ok because others do it" is also stupid.

If everyone had your attitude and let this stuff go on happening WE WOULD BE LEFT WITH ONE COMPANY.

ONE SINGLE COMPANY IN THE WHOLE FREAKING WORLD.
(probably microsoft)

Do you GET IT YET?

The fair trade laws should have stoped Sonys move, and especialy microsofts.

I'll quote again (seeing as I still havnt had a reply to it):

Quote:
If I make billions of pounds saleing trainers does that give me the right to put a load of bakers out of buisness?
By this "its ok" attitude, that would be ok.
It would be ok to bankrupt a load of expirenced bakers, just because you got the money.
After that, you can charge what you want for your vastely inferior product.
(£199 for a Playstation 2? Its starting already....)
--
Twinsal ~ But did it have anything at all that revolutionised gamming? Or even one little invention of something that was unique?
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  #86  
Old 2003-08-26, 19:45
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Not that I know. But I don't think a game has to bring something new to be good. It is a good game, not as good as most Nintendogames, but good.

, we already managed to make someone buy GC.
__________________
It kept me sane for a couple of years
As it drenched my fears
Of becoming like the others
Who become unhappy mothers
And fathers of unhappy kids
And why's that?
'Cause they've forgotten how to play
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  #87  
Old 2003-08-26, 19:59
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Quote:
Originally posted by Darkflame
just because it happens dosnt mean its right

They *should* have to deserve to be in it.
Does it give me the right to murder someone simply because I have? Of course not...your argument "its ok, because they have done it" is nonsense. Just as "its ok because others do it" is also stupid.

If everyone had your attitude and let this stuff go on happening WE WOULD BE LEFT WITH ONE COMPANY.

ONE SINGLE COMPANY IN THE WHOLE FREAKING WORLD.
(probably microsoft)

Do you GET IT YET?

The fair trade laws should have stoped Sonys move, and especialy microsofts.

I'll quote again (seeing as I still havnt had a reply to it):



By this "its ok" attitude, that would be ok.
It would be ok to bankrupt a load of expirenced bakers, just because you got the money.
After that, you can charge what you want for your vastely inferior product.
(£199 for a Playstation 2? Its starting already....)
--
Twinsal ~ But did it have anything at all that revolutionised gamming? Or even one little invention of something that was unique?
I'm not saying that because it happens or because other people do it, it should be ok.
I think it IS ok, nevertheless if it happens or not.
Do you get it?
ALL the powerfull people, who are in charges of the companies competing have this attitude.
The fact that there ISN'T a single company is the only necessary proof it isn't wrong.
No kinds of laws would ever stop Sony's move, because there is NOTHING wrong in it.
It's part of commerce itself, since mankind became to practice it, to expand.
Now yelling at me won't do anything, btw.
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  #88  
Old 2003-08-26, 20:34
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Your simply saying "Its ok because they all do it!!!" again, which is wrong twofold. I keep giving examples why its wrong, and you keep ignoring them.

No, not all companys have that attutude, Nintendo MOVED into games, Sega MOVED into games.
Thousands of other companys have changed, adapted AND WORKED WITH other companys.

Microsoft and Sony dont, they SPREAD. They took over another sector of the market without given up the first.

You arnt reading, or at least not taking it in.

Come on.

"It wont happen because it hasnt happened"

When are you going to start comming up with logical arguments.
Theres NOTHING stopping microsoft from takeing over every company in the world if people had your attitude.

I'll give you yet another example to try to show how wrong this idea is:

*You own a company, you make footballs, you have done it for many years and are good at it.

*Now, suddenly NIKE decides to make footballs.

*But their rich,see, from all the trainers they make.
So they decided to give away 10 free footballswith every trainer.

*Withen 3 years, you are bankrupt.

*NIKE start saleing footballs for twice the price, using cheap labour and inferiour materials and techiques.

Is that RIGHT? Is that ethical?

Of course its bloody not.
Big buisness should not be able to use money earned elsewhere to take over another buisness.
It results in an inferiour product to the consumer, less compition, and a polarisation of world money.
(the richest companys get richer the poorer ones get poorer)
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Last edited by Darkflame; 2003-08-26 at 20:41.
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  #89  
Old 2003-08-26, 20:56
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wow, you really know how to bring it.....uhm....dramatically.
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It kept me sane for a couple of years
As it drenched my fears
Of becoming like the others
Who become unhappy mothers
And fathers of unhappy kids
And why's that?
'Cause they've forgotten how to play
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  #90  
Old 2003-08-26, 21:59
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As long as Sony doesn't brake any rules, their evilness is strictly a matter of opinion.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist
This is work of higher intelligences, who take other, esoteric and psychological sciences into account than we are normally used to even consider, numerology being one of them, because everything for them is ritualistic and everything is meant for a deep programming of our psychological state. One day witchcraft and science will collide.
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  #91  
Old 2003-08-26, 22:29
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True dat.
I won't go on with the discussion because it will be endless, in the end both sides will think the same way they did before and it's overall useless. I'm not interested in discussing this at all.
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  #92  
Old 2003-08-27, 21:16
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You HAVNT discused anything though, you keep saying im wrong but have never said why, or responded in any way to my examples.Without any response It just makes me think you havnt understond or comprehended.
If im wrong, show me where.
What will stop Microsoft?
How does the above example benifit anyone except Nike?
Has Nintendo ever taken over any companys? name them.

You cant expect me to guese your logic, for that I would have to play both sides of the argument
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Last edited by Darkflame; 2003-08-27 at 21:21.
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  #93  
Old 2003-08-27, 21:27
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Whoa, most of my activity here was just stating facts.

Anyway, i never said anything about microsoft, so i'll say now:
Yes they are power hungry corrupt bastards. and they have been since 1994 AT LEAST.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpaceGuitarist
This is work of higher intelligences, who take other, esoteric and psychological sciences into account than we are normally used to even consider, numerology being one of them, because everything for them is ritualistic and everything is meant for a deep programming of our psychological state. One day witchcraft and science will collide.
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