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Little Script Adventure An open-source 3D engine with assets and tools for all future LBA fan-games.

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  #1676  
Old 2010-11-24, 14:21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bot13 View Post
I wish you good luck in the game art industry, sir
FYI, I`m not aiming at the game industry, so you could shut up already. You may keep your remarks to yourself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
I can't believe what I'm seeing ! Well, I've lost my patience, I won't beg you to come back. Removing all your stuff from repo cause we asked to change a bit texture tone shows it's unpossible to work with you. Open source project doesn't mean it has to be a chaos. There's an artist and development director here,making sure things can connect correctly. I believe people can still have fun working with us. You decide.
As I wrote in my previous post - Jasiek could retouch the textures. I think it`s the best way. I didn`t remove "all my stuff". As you can see - only the Citadel prison is deleted, since I`m almost done with it and I was planning to upload it today (may be). Besides, my proposal of removing all my stuff from the repo, rests on pure logic - if you don`t like them, why do you need them anyway? I could use them for other projects (my own or working with someone else). As for the decisions - I`m not the one who decides if I`m staying in the project, it`s up to you to accept my contributions. I`ve spent enough hours in making models and textures and again this labor seems to be on waste. I have much free time and I could invest it here. And surely there will be other people who could contribute one or another thing, but all the fun goes away when such discussions happen. I thought I made it clear that I won`t bend my style and if some corrections are needed to be done, I leave this to Jasiek, since you`ve accepted his style. I`ve spent 4 years at the university, studying design and working with colleagues over tons of projects, so I perfectly know what teamwork is - everyone is complementing one another. This here IS NOT teamwork - you`re acting as a client or as an employer, you have BIG expectations from the people and call "chaos" their individual vision or personal touch. Currently you`re working alone over the code, just because you`re unable to co work with other programmer. The same goes for the game vision - you see only one style and you couldn`t even accept proposals or possibilities for combining two styles of work. The art is not like writing code, you see. I`m sick and tired of such conversations. I`m losing time to write this, instead of making something more useful. I don`t want you to beg me to stay, nor I`ll beg you for the same - this is beneath my dignity. It seems that you`re pretty unsure what you want. You want people to work over this project, but overall it seems that you need brainless monkeys without opinion or own vision of the things.
So, if you want me to continue my work, let me know. If not - I`d ask you to remove all the stuff I made for this project and all derivations from these stuff.
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  #1677  
Old 2010-11-24, 14:57
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I think the textures in the sewer fit nicely actually - the rocks look really excellent and I can see you tried to fit me with those and done an awesome job with that, and if I may retouch the colour hues I'm all ok with it!!!
I really like the addition of the pipe btw.

As far as vision goes, it's ok with me if you totally change the whole map and go wild with it (round the walls, add more piping whatever), as long as we keep the original function and paths in it - Reimagining > Remaking.

I'm also trying to do an experiment on the outside (figuring out how to make walls with door frames and windows in them with normal maps etc.) and the texture's I'm doing there are a tad more gritty so maybe they'll fit what you're doing a bit better.

EDIT:
The map seems a bit too crispy for my taste, but as I said if I can modify the textures a bit I'm ok with it.
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Last edited by Jasiek; 2010-11-24 at 16:34.
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  #1678  
Old 2010-11-24, 15:52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horadrim View Post
You want people to work over this project, but overall it seems that you need brainless monkeys without opinion or own vision of the things.
lol ! Exactly ! I'll treat you all like this !



Quote:
Originally Posted by Horadrim View Post
This here IS NOT teamwork - you`re acting as a client or as an employer, you have BIG expectations from the people and call "chaos" their individual vision or personal touch.
Jesus Christ, you are comparing me to this !



Quote:
Originally Posted by Horadrim View Post
Currently you`re working alone over the code, just because you`re unable to co work with other programmer.
I can't work with somebody changing and reorganizing all source files from a day to the other !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horadrim View Post
So, if you want me to continue my work, let me know
Of course we all want it, as long as you don't mind if we modify it, as I see this is impossible from your side.
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  #1679  
Old 2010-11-24, 16:35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
I can't work with somebody changing and reorganizing all source files from a day to the other !
Basically, you need just ONE big rewrite. It may sound like a difficult task, but it's a necessary thing to do. The code right now is hard to understand and modify: this is probably the reason why teamwork is impossible now. Better planning of game architecture (in fact, any planning will suffice, because right now you have none. no offense), proper using of object-oriented programming and implementing some design patterns might help.
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  #1680  
Old 2010-11-24, 16:35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horadrim View Post
FYI, I`m not aiming at the game industry, so you could shut up already. You may keep your remarks to yourself.
Then it would be wise to admit to the people who are working in this industry that you don't know shit about the subject, and you only think you do by means of personal view and not experience.

Don't go around posting images of your work with fear of being critizised according to the ways of the actual industry. If you just want a cookie instead of the truth about your work, you may kindly request so and I'll take it in to consideration.
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  #1681  
Old 2010-11-24, 17:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bot13 View Post
Then it would be wise to admit to the people who are working in this industry that you don't know shit about the subject, and you only think you do by means of personal view and not experience.
I was starting to wonder when you`ll start droping hints about your job. The fact I said that I`m not aiming at the game industry, doesn`t mean that I don`t have the education or the knowledge to do it. You know nothing about MY experience, so once again - keep your remarks to yourself! I could imagine what your experience or abilities are, since you`re searching for suitable motive to show your "competency", by fiddling with someone else`s work. May be you don`t receive the right attitude or admirations at your work, so you`re uniformly trying to show how "competent" or "talented" you are here?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bot13 View Post
Don't go around posting images of your work with fear of being critizised according to the ways of the actual industry. If you just want a cookie instead of the truth about your work, you may kindly request so and I'll take it in to consideration.
Once again - insulting is not criticism. Words like "you don't know shit about the subject" and "you suck at <something here>" are words of an idiot who can`t explain his point of view instead. You`re a joke, boy. Once again, don`t bother me further more!
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  #1682  
Old 2010-11-25, 17:15
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I didn't wanted to enter that, but Horadim, Jasiek and David make an great team, they shouldn't be conflicting themselves only because of a color tone or a file reorganization!
Where did the good friends gone? They are the heart of this project!

David: We need only one big change, like ambient said.
Horadim: Insulting or fighting is not really a way to do things.
Bot13: Why did you wanna make them fight?
Jasiek: Continue with good work.

And to someone that want to critique me about this post: I'm trying to stop this fight, trying to be an mediator, I'm not on side of anyone!

Another thing: The textures look great, both Horadim and Jasiek ones, on my point of view, both of them could review the other textures and suggest changes, if the other agree, they could make an alternative texture on the repo (not simply override the old one).
This is teamwork.
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  #1683  
Old 2010-11-25, 18:07
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We already settled the problems down. So this discussion ends here.
For the record - I`m posting quick renders of the models I make, just to show the current progress. As for the critics - the only one who could criticize my work is Jasiek, since he`s the lead designer. I`ll ignore all other "competent" remarks.

Last edited by Horadrim; 2010-11-25 at 18:13.
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  #1684  
Old 2010-11-26, 18:54
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Okay Horadim,
Well, I'm excited to see your renders...
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  #1685  
Old 2010-11-29, 01:36
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I've written two docs for modelers :

trunk\docs\blender - linking.txt
trunk\docs\texture naming conventions.txt

The first one explains how to link blender files, to connect map and props, and the second how to name your textures.
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  #1686  
Old 2010-11-29, 13:01
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Here rises the question with the maps, modelled outside Blender. The dimensions of the levels is not the same when imported, I mean - the maps modelled in Blender are with different scale than the maps modelled in Max for example. So how we`ll match the correct scale? I think we should have one standart scale cube with Twinsen`s height, since he`s our main character.
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  #1687  
Old 2010-11-29, 13:08
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the whole lsa world unit is the cell dimension, the same than in original LBA1, and playable maps should be 64x64 cell. If a scaling is needed, just press "s" in the 3D window
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  #1688  
Old 2010-11-29, 16:30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
the whole lsa world unit is the cell dimension, the same than in original LBA1, and playable maps should be 64x64 cell. If a scaling is needed, just press "s" in the 3D window
Well, I know that, but you see, the 64X64 is just a proportion. You could have 64X64 centimeters, 64x64 inches and so on. Currently, I`m working with the standart 3DS MAX units as dimension, but I`m sure it differs from the Blender`s dimension units. In example, look at this column, it`s made with LBA1 bricks, but the scale differs. This column should be as high as Twinsen is. If I must scale it down, what dimensions should I use? Or at least, how many times should I scale it down? Surely if I use some trial and error, I`ll manage to scale it down at least visually, but actually it won`t be 100% the same scale as such column, made in Blender.
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  #1689  
Old 2010-11-29, 16:34
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I propose you create a cube, all 1 unit, and export as an obj, then open it with notepad and check vertices coordinate are the same than in MAX.
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  #1690  
Old 2010-11-29, 17:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David View Post
I propose you create a cube, all 1 unit, and export as an obj, then open it with notepad and check vertices coordinate are the same than in MAX.
Well, they`re not, as I said:

3DS MAX exported cube:
<code>
v 15.1725 -15.1726 -15.1726
v -15.1727 -15.1726 -15.1726
v -15.1727 15.1726 -15.1726
v 15.1725 15.1726 -15.1726
v -15.1727 -15.1726 15.1726
v -15.1727 15.1726 15.1726
v 15.1724 15.1726 15.1726
v 15.1724 -15.1726 15.1726
</code>

Blender exported cube:
<code>
v 0.0500 0.0500 0.0500
v -0.0500 0.0500 0.0500
v -0.0500 -0.0500 0.0500
v 0.0500 -0.0500 0.0500
v 0.0500 -0.0500 -0.0500
v 0.0500 0.0500 -0.0500
v -0.0500 0.0500 -0.0500
v -0.0500 -0.0500 -0.0500
</code>
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  #1691  
Old 2010-11-29, 17:46
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Okay - Let's say that 1 LSA unit is equal blender 0.100, or MAX 30.345...
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  #1692  
Old 2010-11-29, 17:51
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Blender export the unit cube perfectly (the one you see while doing file->new)

v 1.000000 -1.000000 -1.000000
v 1.000000 -1.000000 1.000000
v -1.000000 -1.000000 1.000000
v -1.000000 -1.000000 -1.000000
v 1.000000 1.000000 -1.000000
v 0.999999 1.000000 1.000001
v -1.000000 1.000000 1.000000
v -1.000000 1.000000 -1.000000
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  #1693  
Old 2010-11-30, 12:40
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I`m exporting a cube, made of LBA1 blocks.
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  #1694  
Old 2010-11-30, 15:17
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do you mean blocks from perspective map viewer ? They are 1x1x0.5
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  #1695  
Old 2010-11-30, 20:10
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Quote:
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do you mean blocks from perspective map viewer ? They are 1x1x0.5
As I said - box, made of blocks. That means 2 blocks, stacked one over another.
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  #1696  
Old 2010-11-30, 20:14
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so what's exactly the problem ? perspective map viewer cell is 1x1. All repo maps have 1x1 cells too, in blender, objs, lsa format, everywhere. I don't understand where this 0.05x0.05 comes from.

Edit : 0.1x0.1
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  #1697  
Old 2010-11-30, 21:55
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Oh... dude, the problem is in the metric units, used by the both programs - 3DS MAX and Blender. No matter if the cell proportions are the same, if they`re in different metric units. My question was how to scale down a whole map, made in 3DS MAX, as if it was made in Blender. As long as I see, all imported objects, made in 3DS MAX are enormously big in Blender. Yes, I could scale it down, but what values should I use? This is my problem - how to scale a map correctly?
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  #1698  
Old 2010-11-30, 23:10
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There is no metric value, I decided 1 unit is a cell because LBA1 made this choice. If you have a 1x1x1 cube in MAX that exports to a 25x25x25 cube in an OBJ, the problem is from MAX. But don't worry about that, we will find how much it has to be scaled easily since your maps have bricks and we know how big should be a brick.
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  #1699  
Old 2010-12-01, 12:40
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they are rabibunny animations of ttrtomboy in repo.
trunk\models\ttrtomboy

They are Blender 2.5 and can't be exported to lsa. Does anyone know how to open those animations in Blender 2.49 ?
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  #1700  
Old 2010-12-01, 15:05
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Quote:
Blender 2.5 is currently in the test version release cycle, beginning with the release of Alpha 0 version on 24 November 2009, and currently 2.55 Beta as of the 4th of November.[17] New features currently in 2.55 include:

....

New animation system, which allows almost any value to be animated
It seems that 2.5 uses entirely different animation system, so that`s why the data couldn`t be imported correctly.
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